Prophet and the Mosque Aqsa – Miraj – Alburaq – Time Travel


Allegation:

  1. The Mosque Al Aqsa was built by the Caliph Omer so which mosque did prophet mohammed pbuh visited during the Night of Miraj or the Spritual Journey?? this proves that he lied.

Context of the Discussion

This Discussion took place on facebook in a post uploaded by a so called ‘confused’ muslim. Following is the reproduction of the exact communication that took place. Several comments and links were deleted by the poster.  Alhamdulillah we tried to answer to those allegations. Please read and conclude yourself

Actual Conversation:

  • Mobarak Haider Ghulam Rasool sahab, I strongly object to the image in this post. You are a serious researcher and have right to express your disagreement. But personalities highly respected by billions of our fellow humans should not be insulted. I invite friendsMuhammad Tariq Satti , Obaidullah Khan, Ammar Ahmad Siddiqui and others to help me understand what is right and wrong in this narrative.
  • Ghulam Rasool Sorry, if I hurt someone’s feeling, did not mean that. I spent whole night writing this. It took such long time because my urdu typing speed is extremely poor. I have problem finding letters. I was tired, wanted to sleep because it was morning. So, I uploaded the image which was handy at that time. Anyway, older image is replaced with a new one. I hope this would be ok for all
    Thursday at 12:41pm · Like · 3
  • Muhammad Tariq Satti Ahsan Sibeel , Moazzam Islam,Muhammad Tufail ShadMuzaffar Mughal and Bakhtiar Qayyum , please comment.Mobarak Haider, Ghulam Rasool has right to ask : ), however , he has not acceded to my request to change his profile pic by some flower or some kind of beauty if he doesn’t like to use his own pic. Each time I see his profile pic , my mind gets disturbed: ) Now you tell him , I feel he listens to you.
  • Obaidullah Khan استغفراللہ، استٖغفراللہ،استغفراللہ۔ میں یہ کیا اول فول بک رہا ہوں، شائد میری بدّھی بھرشٹ ہو گئی ہے، اس بڑھاپے نے میری مت مار دی ہے۔ اے مالک دو جہاں مجھے معاف فرما، مجھ پر شیطان حاوی ہو گیا ہے۔ “” آپ کی اس بات سے مجھے مکمل اتفاق ہے۔ کیونکہ آپ کو سیدھی سی بات سمجھ نہیں آرہی ہے کہ یہ ایک کشف تھا حقیقتاً ایسا کوئی واقع نہیں ہوا۔ ایسے کشف انبیا کو ہوتے آئے ہیں ۔ لیکن یہ ایک نہائیت اعلیٰ درجے کا کشف تھا۔ جو مسائل آپ کو سمجھ نہیں آرہے یہ سب وہ استعارے ہیں جو خوابون میں نظر آجاتے ہیں۔ اور انکی تعبیر کرنی پڑتی ہے۔
  • Ghulam Rasool Sahih Al-Bukhari HadithHadith 4.636/585 Narrated byAbu Dhaar
    I said, “O Allah’s Apostle! Which mosque was built first?” He replied, “Al-Masjid-ul-Haram.” I asked, “Which (was built) next?” He replied, “Al-Masjid-ul-Aqs-a (i.e. Jerusalem).” I asked, “What was the period in between them?” He replied, “Forty (years).”
  • Kamran Ahmed a miracle is a phenomenon not fully explained by known laws of nature , a supernatural intervention in the life of human beings,an event that occurs outside the laws of nature as we know them,Extraordinary events which appear to violate the known laws of nature, the cause of which is ascribed to God. so its advisable not to intervene and only try to know what we need to know as human being. Ghulam Rasool Sahib you seems to be extremely qualified(please dont go beyond the laws of nature) , please leave the GOD”s work to GOD and you can be very benifcial to society by sharing your valuable knowledge
  • Ahsan Sibeel Quran was not any religious Book to start with, it was and is a Book of Philosophy, it did not contain any rituals; laterone like king Constantine when his empire was on a brink of dissolution, he was looking for some unification bond to keep the country intact, he transformed Jesus’ philosophy into a religion and fabricated these four canonical Gospels that are believed as Divine Books of christianty in 324 AD, likewise Abbasid’s needed something to keep their Vast tertories that were conquered over the years under smooth control. 
    What can be better then Religion as we know a Sword (Armies) only control bodies but religion (God) controls mind and bodies are controlled by mind, so by controlling minds you can control bodies automatically, thus they transformed Islam of Sir Mohammad into a religion, for religion we need some rituals and rituals were not found in the original Islam (Quran).
    Invention of Rivayats were to justify rituals, for Nimaz they fabricated this event of Meraj to validate and justify Nimaz, but they forgot the details of it, no hadis contains details of Namaz, only explains different ways to perform it but not the real contents. 
    Brother Muhammad Tariq Satti, this is the reality of this event of Meraj, besides I will request brother Ghulam Rasool to remove this pic as requested by brother Mobarak Haider.
  • Ahsan Sibeel One more point in this post is the words of the Verse….. 
    Min al ‘Masjadil Haram’ Ilal ‘Masjadil Aqsa’ and we all know what does Haram means….. anybody to clarify, if it was called Masjid(Markaz)-E-Haram by Quran itself then how it is still being honoured and why ?
  • Kamran Ahmed Ahsan Sibeel Sahib Allah (SWT) has said in the Noble Qur’an: “I have not created the jinn and humankind for any other purpose except that they should worship Me.” (Noble Qur’an 51:56)

    It is clear from the above verse of Noble Qur’an that the purpose of our birth and of our life is no other than that of the worship of Allah (SWT). There are many acts of worship (Ibadah, Ibadat) in Islam, and Salah(NIMAZ) is one of the most important obligatory acts.Salah (Salat, Namaz) is a practical sign of obedience to the commands of Allah (SWT). Its importance has been emphasized about 500 times in the Noble Qur’an. and I also agree picture to be removed by Ghulam Rasool Sahib for good order sake
  • Kamran Ahmed The Arabic term ḥaram has a meaning of “sanctuary” or “holy site” in Islam !! As used in Islamic urban planning, the word ḥaram (حرم) means “inviolate zone”, an important aspect of urban planning in Muslim civilization. Such protected areas were sanctuaries, or places where contending parties could settle disputes peacefully.
  • Ahsan Sibeel Kamran Ahmed can we apply this defination of Haram on everything that is pronounced Haram by Quran ? Adultry is Haram, Killing of Innocent is Haram, Steeling is Haram, if we apply this defination to steeling it would be like entering into someone place to settle disputes, likewise enguaing some Namaharm to settle dispute etc etc. ? 
    Though I appreciate your love for Islam and Quran, I love it as well, but I also like to be in Light (Noor) and not Zill (ignorance or religion), besides Quran has taught me to not to believe any thing which is on the basis of ‘heresay’ and that I am not convinced of ” 
    WA LA TAQFO MA LAISA LAKA BEHI ILMUNN and 
    QUL HADE’HI SABEELI AD’OO ILLALA HE ALA BASEERATAN 
    Quran advises me to make my decisions on Haq and not others understandings or fabrications (Ahwa).
  • Ahsan Sibeel 51/56: The Arabic word is ‘Yaabodu’ its root is ‘ABD’ which means Ghulam…. Ghulams never prey to their master, they listen to and obey to his orders.
  • Kamran Ahmed Ahsan Sahib -The Arabic language has two separate words, حرم ḥaram and حرام ḥarām, both derived from the same triliteral Semitic root Ḥ-R-M. Both of these words can mean “forbidden” and/or “sacred” in a general way, but each has also developed some specialized meanings. here we r talking about حرم / sacred
  • Kamran Ahmed The Quranic evidence weighs the evidence in favour of SJD meaning “to submit/honour/pay respect”, “masjid” meaning “time of SJD”, “al masjid al haram” meaning “the inviolable time of SJD” (i.e. the term referring to the time-period/event of the inviolable months). This understanding provides a logical, coherent and practical answer throughout, and helps answer some of the most difficult questions in Quran exegesis (e.g. 17:1-8, 17:60, 2:142-150).
  • Kamran Ahmed coming back to topic – miracles need no explanations – its a matter of belief
  • Amjad Hussain Kamran Ahmed, can you stop your preaching and talk about miracles? Pleaseeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee, talk something logical which a human being can buy and stay with the topic of this page.
  • Amjad Hussain Mohammad had heard about the Irani story of that King to go to sky to meet his deity through his in-laws Jews scholar and painted the picture for himself with little changes.

    When some critical person asked him forget about 7th sky just show me that you can fly to the top of the mountain in front of you, Mohammad called him Abu-Jahal.
  • Mushtaq Ahmad A belief by definition is not supported by proof; otherwise it would be accepted or refuted as knowledge. Same is true for a dream — a dream is a dream and no more; otherwise it would be called experience, and its validity would depend upon verification. Why spend so much time on some’s dream fron 1500 years ago when we need all the knowledge and reason to explore and learn from nature. Give the man credit for his honesty in describing a dream only as a dream and not something else, and then move on to stark realities we face in everyday’s life. We have come a long way in last 1500 years, and with the present and future means of analysis we would comprehend the so called miracles differently in the future. 
    Reason and logic is incompatible with beliefs and hearsays. Why try to explain something which does not depend upon explanation or varification?
  • Ahsan Sibeel I spent almost 20 years exploring Quran and other books of religions, and I had studied philosophy and some other branches of tree of knowledge whose roots are in Consciousness. 
    You are very right dear Mushtaq Ahmad to say why to waste time, I have already done it. Let me share my conclusion please : 
    Quran is a beautifull book of philosophY and has nothing to do with God or religion, Quran’s ‘Allah’ was not any God or Deity or any sky Dad, it was Consciousness/wisdom/Fitrat,
    ALLAH = AL LAW = THE LAW, Law is basically an Arabic word used in English as well. 
    BILLAH = RULE OF LAW, 
    RUBB = YOUR FREE WILL 
    RUBBI = YOUR INTERESTS (INDIVIDUAL)
    RUBBIL AALAMEEN = CUMMULATIVE INTEREST (MUFAD-E-AAMA).
  • Ahsan Sibeel @ Kamran Ahmed please dont play with words Haram and Harm, two different words.
  • Ghulam Rasool Ahsan Sibeel, the picture which Mobarak Haidermeant was taken down, the picture you are seeing now is the new one. Why do you have problem with this picture. BTW, I have changed the picture again, this picture is taken from a Turkish site ( a Muslim country). You have come with a very new conclusion about Allah= AL Law etc. I hope their are many who share you view. I hope you are not taken as a person who is polluting religion. By the way, I am still looking fro philosophy in the holy book. WOuld inform others when I would find that.
  • Ghulam Rasool Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 5, Book 58, Number 228:
    Narrated Ibn ‘Abbas:The sights which Allah’s Apostle was shown on the Night Journey when he was taken to Bait-ul-Maqdis (i.e. Jerusalem) were actual sights, (not dreams). And the Cursed Tree (mentioned) in the Quran is the tree of Zaqqum (itself).
  • Rehan Siddiqui The real true men dont go to space in dreams , they invent spaceships , go there , come back and tell the world.
  • Ahsan Sibeel Sorry brother Ghulam Rasool, I was not aware of the fact about PIC, peace brother. I thought we should be on a much higher state then these Mullahs, thanks for removing the pic.
  • Ahsan Sibeel Brother Ghulam Rasool I have had my share of Fatwas and had been kicked out of neighbourhood already, they do that to everyone who frees himself from their cage, nothing new, we must pay the price, on the charge you have mentioned.
  • Kamran Ahmed sorry brothers for my intervention I didn’t know that you don’t believe in miracles – but I appreciate for your efforts and deep knowledge being shared on the topic which was one of the most important miracle of Muhammad – stay blessed
  • Rehan Siddiqui Respected sir, There is a universal law of Physics, ” Reasons happen before an event ” there is no place for miracles in the physical world you and I live. You can believe in whatever you want but that wont make your believes to be true but rather cast more doubts on them.
  • Rehan Siddiqui Dont understand why our educated class believe in concocted fables, allegories and stories in the name of religion. Why they dont approach religion the same way they study their subjects in science ??? why they dont question the authenticity of these sacred texts, why they dont test it through logic, reasoning and experimenting like they do it in other disciplines ??? why do we close our eyes in front of the blatant of the lies and start believing it ??? 
    How come an educated person can claim to believe in the miracles in this age of reason and yet at the same time claim to be an educated one ???? Isnt it the reason we are behind rest of the world ???

    Rationality already has become the world’s third largest religion. The the advancement in the science in last two decades is the proof and reason why it is fastest growing religion in the world. 

    Even for the sake of argument we believe it was a Miracle of God, then why all knowing God needed a miracle of this kind to prove His religion to be true, whilst it is doing exactly the opposite ??? Or if it was only for the people of medieval time then why we still practicing it ?? 

    If we want to get along with the pace of the rest of the world, we need to unshackle our coming generations from these believes and stories. otherwise, despite being the 1.5billions we will be the same as we are today and this divide will be widen every single day, world is moving 10 times faster than it was two decades ago and we are going back at the same proportion.
  • Ghulam Rasool Atheism is not the fastest growing RELIGION but fastest growing group of people.  It is said there are 1.6 billion muslims and 1.5 billion athiests in the world. I agree we have to break away from these myths and dogmas which are holding us back. I really get shocked when I see people writing much better English than me but still believing in those fairy tales. I hope these guys are not educated in “Madrassas”. I have heard they teach English in Madrassas.
  • Rehan Siddiqui I was alluding to the common practice to put Atheism as religion as they put it in the category of religion in the surveys which is wrong.
  • Ghulam Rasool Please comment on the content of the note, rather than posting religious rapping from youtube.
  • Ghulam Rasool Still waiting for some comments based on rationality rather than sermon about the miracles.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui you have deleted the comments, this is the worst form of intolerance that you showed. would any sensible person ever talk to you?
  • Ghulam Rasool I have not deleted anything, I just see a youtube upload which is still there, though I don’t like it to be here because this is off topic.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui I am extremely sorry and apologize, i got confused due to facebook
  • Najma Siddiqi Useful, well documented. Could be educational for those still searching… Thanks for sharing.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui In the ancient world, the philosophical fools use to laugh and mock at those who claimed that in the future flying machines (aircraft) will be build which will travel at unimaginable speed .. 

    they used to explain them with words like

    “LOL.. you think you will be in Rome at day and will reach Persia by night…..” (Note that they they did not use the modern vocabulary of ‘vehicles’ ‘machines’ or ‘aircraft’ instead they used their limited intellect of their time to describe the idea.

    The history remembered these people as fools uncivilized narrow minded and mentally retards. 

    They also mocked at how a donkey can travel so fast, but today we have motorcycles.

    I think such people exists in all time !!
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui Today’s primitive Time Travel 

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_travel

    and if you really don’t believe in the spiritual dimension ; ) ??

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multiverse

    en.wikipedia.org

    Time travel is the concept of moving between different points in time in a manne…See More
  • Ahsan Sibeel Regarding Miracles : 
    God of Moses and Aron, gave them Nine Miracles to rescue Bani Israel, didn’t work, Firoun and his maliaka resisted them, and Almighty God and His Apostals, The God of Kun – Fa Yakoon couldn’t destroy Feroun and his forces and rescue his beloved nation, yet through another Miracle, Moses, Aron and their God Almight plus over 0.4 million people proved to be of no competition to Feroun, and had to decievingly drowned them in the River, what was proved in the whole story, God of All Powers or God of miracles ? 
    This is religion and not Quran itself.
  • Ghulam Rasool Please, come to the point. This note is not about Firon or the “miracles” of Moses. This note is dealing about a 7th century bedouin, claimed to ride a flying donky and not merely wnet to heaven but he also reached to A MOSQUE WHICH NEVER EXISTED AT THAT TIME. That man made his followers to bow toward a garbage dump. Please, check history and reply in a rational way. Religious scripture is full of non sense which everybody can quote but there is no evidence to prove those claims. According to Hindu ” Agni Shastar” mentioned in their book is present day missile. Should we accept that claim. I am deleting these “evidence” which is posted in form of youtube upload from Islamic sites. Please, read the article again and try to reply to the points it is mentioning.
    11 hours ago · Like · 1
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui re read my response, you will get answers.

    The acceptance of spiritual domain (multiverse) by the science is the answer to all allegations in your wonder of literature posted above.

    Your text is mixture of bible, quran and other myths. it will take time to isolate the lies in bible and myths by the ancient people from the wording of Quran which i m here to defend! 

    I will gradually respond to this and i am already working to compile my response. you will get it for sure.

    The response about Firon is a scientific evidence of the validation of Verses of Quran. DNA tests have confirmed that. please google it. This was also the rebuttal to the claim made by Ahsan as well.

    I will respond to few points that i found worth researching. very soon.

    When mohammed pbuh tell such stories, we will have to accept it because of the other excellent scientific evidences which he provided and no man on earth of his time could.

    1. Exact description and shape of the human embyro – Confirmed by the Modern Science. this was not possible until the development of latest radiology and XRAY equipments.

    how did mohammed see the exact shape of a 0.4 mm sized embryo in the womb??

    http://www.answering-christianity.com/embryonic_development.htm

    2. Exact detail of the color of the dying stars known as nebulae which are light years sway and that could only be seen through latest hubble telescope stationed in the space. note that some of the nebula are visible from naked eye but eye can not see the color only white or grey Shade.

    http://alquraan.co.uk/#/the-cats-eye-nebula/4554927629

    The people of the time of Mohammed pbuh accepted him by seeing and noting his character. the 100,000 followers of Mohammed of his time who were ready to lay their lives for his cause and you acted upon his each and every sayings was a miracle at the time.

    www.answering-christianity.com

    Search and find articles and topics quickly and accurately!  See different advanced ways to search for articles on this site.
  • Ghulam Rasool Please comment on the point raised in this note. We can come later to the “scientfic nature” of Quran later in a new article. Can you please come with your own comments, I have no time to read all these links you are posting which in fact have nothing to do with the topic.
  • Ghulam Rasool Muhammad Tariq Satti, I would change my profile picture whenever I will find some suitable picture. BTW, how can you have the feeling of disgust toward a creation of Allah Mian. Neanderthal is a much higher form of living than flowers. Flowers or trees can not move, they don’t have nerves as other living being , therefore they don’t feel pain. How can you call a lower form of life i.e. flowers to be more beautiful than a much higher form of life like Neanderthal. We are lucky they did not survie, otherwise possibly this planet would have belonged to them. Anyway, your comments about the note are missing, had useful debate with you last time. Current note is missing that kind of debate. All I can see is links to other site, youtube file ( which i deleted) and all those stories about miracles and justification. Waiting for rational arguments about the topic and RELATING TO THE NOTE.
    10 hours ago · Like · 1
  • Khalid Thathaal Posting links from answering-christianity.com or answering-islam.com is not a debate. Moreover none of the links given refutates the “allegations” in the article. One should take these positively and do a soul searching rather than defending some fallacies on every cost. Myths had been travelling in the past and later incorporated in the holy scripture. Just think of the boy who was put in a basket and flown to the river. To religious people, this immediately point to Moses. But this myth is in fact from Mesopotamia. Saragon of Mesopotamia was put in the basket and flown to Euphrates river. He lived long before Moses. A similiar story is Karna of Mahabharata. His mother Kunti put him in the similiar basket and let it float in Ganges river. It is time to revisit those age old myths, just imagine, the closest star to earth is around 5 light years from us. A man can ride a flying donkey and he reaches in heaven and come back the same night. JUST IMAGINE.
    10 hours ago · Edited · Like · 1
  • Ghulam Rasool Pervez Hoodbhoy

    “Specious theological beliefs, together with reliance on miracles and superstitions, have acted as a brake on social progress and often rendered peoples vulnerable to the depredations of science-based imperialism. Muslims have been the worst sufferers”.–PH
  • Mushtaq Ahmad KT: Obviously they must have encapsulated the donkey in a heavenly rocket; otherwise, the effect of friction, on the donkey and its rider, at that speed would have rubbed off everything even with divine protection. Physics has its own laws that are not influenced by holy commands.
    6 hours ago · Edited · Like · 1
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui صاف صاف کہیں کے ہم پاکستان اور انڈیا کے فارغ ترین لوگ ہیں .. میٹرک انٹر میں اچھے نمبر نہ لا سکے اور سائنس کے مضامین نہ مل سکے ! نہ ڈاکٹر بن پاے نہ انجنیئر !

    اسی لیے انگلش میں ماسٹرس اردو میں ماسٹرس فلسفے میوزک ڈانس وغیرہ جیسے مضامین چن لیے 

    اسی لیے فلسفے سے اگے عقل کھلی نہیں !
    تبھی اپنے دماغی فتور کا حل فلسفے میں ہی نکلے گا تو سمجھیں گے ! سائنس ہمارے سر پر سے گزرے گے
    تو اس پر بات نہیں کریں گے ! اور اس کو حجت نہیں مانیں گے !

    میں نہ مانوں کا علاج میرے پاس نہیں !
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui مشتاق صاحب اتنے بزرگ آدمی ہیں !
    میں خوا مخا ان کو سائنس کی جدید دریافت 
    سٹرنگز تھیوری کے حوالے دے رہا ہوں !
    علم فلکیات میں ہونے والی جدید تحقیق جس سے روحانیت سبط ہوتی ہے کی طرف متوجو کر رہا ہوں !
    میرا خیال ہے یہ عقل کی معراج کو پا چکے ہیں 
    شاید اس لیے اس طرف سوچ نہیں پا رہے 
    ورنہ اردو اور انگریزی دونوں طریقہ کر اختیار کر چکا ہوں !
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui “One should take these positively and do a soul searching rather than defending some fallacies on every cost. Myths had been travelling in the past and later incorporated in the holy scripture. Just think of the boy who was put in a basket and flown to the river. To religious people, this immediately point to Moses. But this myth is in fact from Mesopotamia. Saragon of Mesopotamia was put in the basket and flown to Euphrates river. He lived long before Moses. A similiar story is Karna of Mahabharata. His mother Kunti put him in the similiar basket and let it float in Ganges river”

    Response!

    Lets assume a million infants float in basket !

    Did all of them influenced history?? Did all of them manage to liberate their nations from the world’s most severe enslavation by the word’s powerful empire?

    Open your brain.
  • Khalid Thathaal Don’t you think you don’t have any argument to support your case, so you start passing cheap remarks. How does “string theory” or the notion of Multiverse support your case. This note is not about science but a supposedly a historic event. Why don’t you just provide some evidence that Al-Aqsa mosque exxisted at the time of prophet’s night journey. If you can prove that, it would be much easier to rebut this note written by Ghulam Rasool. What an irony, there was a time that scientific claims were judge with the “holy” scripture”. If something did not match, was discarded as a lie. Many were burnt. I hope you must have read about them. Now you are trying to justify some fable with the help of science, a fable which scientist would merely laugh at. I know what kind of difficult situation you are facing. It is difficult to leave age old belief, the beliefs which are fed to us since childhood. I have gobe through this hard time, for sure Ghulam Rasool had gone through that time. It is not wise to dig deep our head in the sand. Rise up, you might a different reality. try to see on the other side of coin too.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui “It is time to revisit those age old myths, just imagine, the closest star to earth is around 5 light years from us. A man can ride a flying donkey and he reaches in heaven and come back the same night. JUST IMAGINE.”

    Response!

    Just imagine they are trying to send material particles thousands of light years away !! HA HA HA !!! how stupids are these people who can even imagine such things…

    [Note: The people who mocks at the scientists while they are striving to achieve some thing are themselves the biggest retards on this planet]

    what about the people in the past who gave the footprints and dreams of these future technologies thousands of years ago ??? ! should’t they be considered more advance then us?

    http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn2312-quantum-wormholes-could-carry-people.html

    www.newscientist.com

    Ghost radiation could widen a wormhole to allow someone to travel to another part of the Universe
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui “l Don’t you think you don’t have any argument to support your case, so you start passing cheap remarks. How does “string theory” or the notion of Multiverse support your case”

    how many times should i write to you ??? Strings theory proves the existence of multiverse !!! parallel universes that exists.. which the religious people call spirtual world !

    Do you read me now?
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui ” If you can prove that, it would be much easier to rebut this note written by Ghulam Rasool. What an irony, there was a time that scientific claims were judge with the “holy” scripture”. If something did not match, was discarded as a lie. Many were burnt. I hope you must have read about them. Now you are trying to justify some fable with the help of science, a fable which scientist would merely laugh at. I know what kind of difficult situation you are facing. It is difficult to leave age old belief, the beliefs which are fed to us since childhood.”

    I am trying to open your little mind towards the fact that

    STRINGS THEORY IS LEADING SCIENCE TO WHERE RELIGION ALREADY TOOK YOU.. THE REALISM OF PARALLEL UNIVERSES ! THE KNOWLEDGE OF THE UNSEEN !

    Do you read me now ?
  • Khalid Thathaal >>Did all of them influenced history?? Did all of them manage to liberate their nations from the world’s most severe enslavation by the word’s powerful empire?<<, Arab empire has not been the only empire in the world, if this is the criteria of the truth. And, please stop posting links, use your own brain. Go find some proof if Al_aqsa existed at the time of prophet. No one has time to read your links. String theory is just a theory yet. And by the way, how does this prove your case.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui If a little quantam hole can carry people millions of light years apart !

    why can’t a little donkey take a person to another universe?

    Please let me know !
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui If no one has time to read my links
    They they should keep living in fool’s paradise !
    its their choice.
    I can not influence them any more.
    its their duty to pay full justice to what participants refer them.
  • Khalid Thathaal >>STRINGS THEORY IS LEADING SCIENCE TO WHERE RELIGION ALREADY TOOK YOU<<, I can see where religion taken muslims, where it is taking Pakistan. Just prove the existance of al-aqsa mosque existed at that time. And start counting the muslim scientist in the worldand stop using bad words, behave
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui You calling Buraqa a Donkey.. which was certainly not a donkey. so you actually initiated the culture of calling bad names to things.
  • Khalid Thathaal Should I call that a space ship?
  • Khalid Thathaal Go find the proof that Al-Aqsa existed at that time, and stop using science from those people who don’t believe in god. check if they believe in your story of a donkey flying to another universe.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui A simple rebuttal ! 

    The first Qiblah of muslims was Mosqe Al Aqsa.

    prophet mohammed asked his followers to offer prayers in the direction of Al-Aqsa.

    In the days of prophet, mecca was the center of arabian trade and caravan from far and wide use to visit kaabah and to pay holy services. 

    that means mecca was the center of news that arabia had. and quresh were considered most emminent ones. they have good ties with the king of egyptia and syrians.

    WHY NOT A SINGLE PERSON MOCKED AT PROPHET about Aqsa?

    “That you fools,, there is no mosque you are pointing your heads at during the worship !”

    ????
  • Mushtaq Ahmad A A S: That is the tragedy of history that of the millions who strive to bring about some change only a few make their name; and, most unfortunately, often the most ruthless ones or those who got ruthless followers.
    As for TIME-TRAVEL & String Theory I see the same programs as you do but I do not mix present day scientific research with tell-tales from centuries ago. Especially by the people from the Semitic regions who never in human history shown any inclination about logical scientific research, but have based their enlightenment upon miracles and the implementation of their will by threats about impending wraths of the Invisible!
    You own argumentation is logic based and you refer to other scientific research based upon deductive and inductive logic; yet, you support proclamations that are completely devoid of logic. 
    As for your remarks about difference between Arts studies and Science studies, I happen to be graduated in both: Science from Govt. College Lahore and Arts from Stockholm University.
    5 hours ago · Edited · Like · 2
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui “As for TIME-TRAVEL & String Theory I see the same programs as you do but I do not mix present day scientific research with tell-tales from centuries ago”

    Lack of your concerns sir. you only live in the present. you can not predict the future and connect with the predictions made in past.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui @Mushtaq Sahab

    Arts from Stockholm.. i told you already.. your excellence is not in science. my prediction was right about you. the science that you studied in govt college is very basic.
  • Khalid Thathaal >>The first Qiblah of muslims was Mosqe Al Aqsa. prophet mohammed asked his followers to offer prayers in the direction of Al-Aqsa.<<, There was no mosque at that time, it was a garbage dump. Are you suggesting that garbage dump was the first qibla. And rhose poor bedouin had no choice than to believe these story.
  • Khalid Thathaal >>WHY NOT A SINGLE PERSON MOCKED AT PROPHET about Aqsa?
    <<, check about Abu Afaq, Ka’b bin Ashraf, check about Asma bint Marwan, check what happened to Fatima bint Rabiah.
  • Mushtaq Ahmad AAS: I finished my studies in 1960 in the college, but that did not put an end to my futher pursuit of knowledge. For your knowledge i worked as a research chemist in England at BFMIRA for 4.5 years, and with researchers in Palynology In Stockholm University 2 years.
    I do not say that I understand all in the latest physics but I am not out of touch. Sweden provides excellent possibilities to stay in touch with the latest in research for those who are interested.
    5 hours ago · Like · 2
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui mushtaq sahab

    please tell honestly, have you solved differential equations of the 5th order? took some integration and differentiation classes ? do you know how to apply Laplace transform??.. 

    khalid thathaal

    The jews and quresh must have had created a lot of propaganda about mohammed at his time.. while they used to mock at him and criticize him all the time.. 

    There is not a single evidence which reveals the fact which you have gotten 1400 years after the incident !

    In history mosques and ancient places gets destroyed and rebuild !

    i assume the aqsa was damaged, it does’t necessarily mean that remains of it were lost, 

    Imagine people talking about babri mosque (india) some thousands years from today [3020] ! and they start mocking my trip to babri mosque in 2012 . .. they would say that babri mosque was destroyed far before 2000.. what did AMMAR visit in 2012?

    Asnwer is simple!

    They would be playing by the lack of recording of actual events by the history and infact trying to fool themselves !

    today if i intend to visit babri mosque, it means i m visiting the demolished place to pay my tribute to some thing which existed in glory.. i will not remember the demolished site as some thing else.. since i have religious and emmotional attachment to that site where it was build.. i will always remember the site what it was ..

    and Quran’s use of word “Al-aqsa” was’t about some thing that was destined to remain as it.. is.. Quran knew that glory of damaged al-aqsa will be back.. and it DID!

    NOTE:

    i have just assumed that you are right about the demolished aqsa.

    NOW I ASK YOU

    PROVE TO ME THAT THE SITE WAS TOTALLY DAMAGED !!…

    I CLAIM THAT THE REMAINS OF AQSA WERE THERE.. SOME ONE WHO VISITED THE AQSA 1400 YEARS FROM TODAY COULD IMAGINE THE REAL MOSQUE AQSA BY SEEING THE DAMAGED REMAINS.
  • Mushtaq Ahmad AAS: No I have not. My main subject was zoology and chemistry, not physics. But what that got to do with scientific thinking? There is no scientist today who would know all about all branches of science; never mind all the Semitic prophets who knew nothing about anything but hearsay that at times proved to be true but about minor explanations of human body and other physical phenomena.

    I do not understand that how you could refer to the equations above and then trust people who could not even count up to 100. Indians gifted them the ZERO to do their simple arithmetic.
    5 hours ago · Edited · Like · 1
  • Mushtaq Ahmad AAS: you better visit Spain, you would be surprised to see what others did to Muslim Mosques.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui Sir Mushtaq: Then please first increase your knowledge in Biology and cosmology. the problem is lack of your sufficient knowledge rather then Quran’s proofs that its truth. how you you appreciate the points regarding the embryo and nebula, when you lack the ability.. Quran ask you to accept the signs by having trust in God or to to verify the signs through science; your wisdom and intellect !.. you are being confused by these students of aristotle and socratte by there mere juggling of words.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui I am not talking about what one group of people did to the noble places of others. I am talking about where our brother Ghulam Rasool and Khalid have deliberately or undeliberately errored in presented some subject to you. 

    They are simply playing with the insufficient recording of history and using that to confuse Muslims. One should see the historical events through the eyes of wisdom rather then through narrow glasses of some text written by hate propagandists.
  • Mushtaq Ahmad AAS: It would appear that about 1.6 billion chose to trust and remain muslims; while those who decided to verify the signs through science left Islam and became enlightened through human research and effort, except a few odd balls who try to swim in the ocean of knowledge but stroke backwards to keep them in the old stream.
    4 hours ago · Edited · Like · 1
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui Our brothers telling us that look AQSA WAS Destroyed oh… mohammed was in error..

    ask them .. wait a second.. what do you mean.. AQSA was destroyed!!.. do you mean the site completely vanished from the face of the earth?? .. ask them if it was destroyed, then why not any emperer build its palace there??? .. why not people occupied the site for other purposes????

    why the site remained as it is ??…

    that simple means the site was still considered respectable .. and the building was destroyed to an extend not to be considered totally lost. 

     All it require a muslim to consider some place as mosque.. is a piece of land.. four walls of reasonable height.. 2-3 foot and surity that the site will not be used for bad purposes e.g. adultry, gambling, bad speech, murders, injustice etc.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui Mushtaq sahab.. your wrote 5 sentences of hate.. there was no logic in your last response.
  • Mushtaq Ahmad AAS: It is not hate because that does not lead us anywhere, but naked truth may appear as hate because that hurts.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui Check this out.. that will debunk your hateful claim

    http://truereligiondebate.wordpress.com/2008/03/03/non-muslim-scientists-embraced-islam-after-discovering-the-miracles-of-the-noble-quran/

    truereligiondebate.wordpress.com

    Scientists’ Comments On The Qur’an Extracts from the video This is the Truth by …See More
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui visit the website .. that will introduce to many great scientists who accepted islam. … that will take you some where.
  • Mushtaq Ahmad AAS: it is both way traffic, so it happens. 
    But eventually are we disputing about the source of knowledge or its application? We share the same world and bear its responsibility collectively. What difference does it make if we draw our strength through religion or science as long as we are constructive and not destructive? Lets us work for a better world and put our energy there than consuming each other in dialectics.
    4 hours ago · Unlike · 1
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui 1. pehly to ab khud science ki field key nahi paye gaye. ap ney bachleors arts main kia ha.. science ki mastery to kia bachlors bhi naheen hap ap.. sirf inter pas hen science main..

    2. dosra ye aqsa vala mamla main to ap ko beywakoof bana dia gaya. critically sochny key bajye.. ek bunder ki dp valey shakhs .. jo key yaqeenun khud utna hi science dan ho ga jitna ap hen… key 500 B.C vali falsafiana teheer or aflatooni gugtagoo sey ap mutasir ho gaye !

    3. ap ka claim bhi ghalat sabit ho gaya… many scientists actually accepted islam after reading quran

    DO YOU ACCEPT YOU WERE WRONGED?
  • Mushtaq Ahmad AAS: Who are you refering to?
    If it is me, please go to my website www.vudya.se and you will get some detailed introduction.

  • Ghulam Rasool Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui, please stop pasting links which does not relate to the topic. Stop being rude to other because they don’t share your view. You don’t know the intellectual calibre of Mushtaq Ahmad. Few days back you behaved the same way to Mobarak Haider. If you continued with such language, then I would have no choice but to block you. You should stop taking others as enemy. They are/were probably better muslim than you. As Far it goes for Scientific quran. I would write some other note where I would like to benefit from your scientific knowledge. As far it goes for Quran, we just find seven earths ( planets which were known at that time) and seven skies. Skies are as a roof on a building, decorated with stars. On first sky is abode of Hazrat Adam and rest you can see in the note. On7th sky is god himself with his angels. Please, don’t mix it with String theory. And, before posting new links, try to read what others have written. There was no mosque at the time of prophet, but a garbage dump. Check when Omar went to jerushalem.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui tell me you talk so much about SCIENCE MODERN WORLD AND LATEST TECHNOLOGIES yet when you are asked to follow THE GREATEST SCIENTISTS WHO ACCEPTED ISLAM.. you quit … : ) .. what kind of justice is that?

    Sir i appreciate your work in the field of art or philosophy.. but since you claim that modern science debunks myths created by religion, therefore i am pointing towards the fact that your knowledge is not sufficient to claim it.

    by the Grace of God Almighty, I have done bachelors in Computer Systems Engineering, M.B.A in Marketing/Proj. Mgt, and currently M.S. in Advance Computer Architecture. 

    have trained by Proj manager Francois Guay, Federal Aviation Authority USA, miss judy bamberger, Author of CMMI model of software management process (Process Solutions Australia), and received direct training from MIT professor Dr. Omer Saf (LUMS University).. i work for GIDS (Pakistan’s defense products exhibitors at world;s top defence exhibitions IDEX, and design team member of pakistan’s JF-17 Thunder aircraft (AERO Advance Engineering Research Organization)

    : )))
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui @ ghulam … i can see you are finding reasons to block me…. 

    when you mock by calling donkey.. its okey
    when you disrespect other views by calling them garbage its okey..

    but when i present evidence and refute, its gets pointed out.. : ))
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui If mr. mushtaq or mabrook would have any issue with me, they will tell me directly. i have survived being on Mr. Zulfiqar list for over a month : ) .. mr. Mabrook sent me add request on facebook. 

    don;t be like a mulla.. let the people know the answer to their problems.
  • Ghulam Rasool I am jst asking you to be polite, otherwise I am thankful to you for all your input. We are here to debate and not to fight. There is no debate if there is only those who share the same view. What do you want me to call burraq.
    4 hours ago · Unlike · 1
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui please respect my religious feelings as well. there is no harm in calling burraq a burraq when its about nourshing a culture of peaceful coexistance.

    you can simply ask question how such a animal can do wonders?… in scientific tone.
  • Ghulam Rasool >>AQSA was destroyed!!.. do you mean the site completely vanished from the face of the earth?? .. ask them if it was destroyed, then why not any emperer build its palace there??? .. why not people occupied the site for other purposes????<<, I must appreciate your jazba-e-eemani and the speed when it comes to reply. But PLEEEEASE, read the note again. Aqsa was not there, it never existed before Abdul Malik bin Marwan got it built. Check when the mosques was built and when the prophet died. For some time, I would abstain from this futile argument with you until you have checked the history when the mosque was first built.
    4 hours ago · Edited · Like · 1
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui “Aqsa was not there, it never existed before Abdul Malik bin Marwan got it built”

    What is the source of this claim? from where did you get the myth?

    caliph omer and caliph marvan both reconstructed it rebuilt it !.. it does’t necessarily mean it was built for the first time !
  • Ghulam Rasool Caliph omar built “Omar Mosque”.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui Masjid al-Aqsa translates from Arabic into English as “the farthest mosque.” The name refers to a chapter of the Qur’an called “The Night Journey” in which it is said that Muhammad traveled from Mecca to “the farthest mosque,” and then up to Heaven on a heavenly creature called al-Buraq al-Sharif.[3][4] 

    Al-Aqsa Mosque as a whole is confused with a particular building within it, also known as al-Jami’ al-Aqsa or al-Qibli or Masjid al-Jumah or al-Mughata, these names refer to the southern building with the silver lead dome.

    For centuries, al-Masjid al-Aqsa referred not only to the mosque, but 
    to the entire sacred sanctuary. This changed during the period of Ottoman rule (c. early 16th century to 1918) when the sanctuary complex came to be known as al Haram ash-Sharif, and the mosque founded by Umar came to be known as al-Jami’ al-Aqsa or al-Aqsa Mosque.[5]

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Aqsa_Mosque

    en.wikipedia.org

    Al-Aqsa Mosque (Arabic:المسجد الاقصىal-Masjid al-Aqsa, IPA: [ʔælˈmæsʒɪd ælˈʔɑqsˤ…See More
  • Ghulam Rasool There are some who knows the story of Al-Aqsa, so they came with the new interpretation that Aqsa mean “the farthest mosque”. But the problem is which is that farthest mosque. We had Masjid-ul-Haram ( Ka’ba) at that time. which is the other mosque labelled as “the farthest mosque”. Remember this Mehraj took place 14 ( as far I can remember) month before the migration to Yathrib. Please, don’t post links. especially Wikipedia which is not taken as that serious. There are thousands of cyber jihadi who edit the articles to fit to their agenda.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui Listen the problem arises from the use of word “Aqsa” in the Quran and the omer’s rebuilt of a mosque by the same name “AQSA” !

    “Mosque Al AQSA” means the “place of worship farthest that was assigned in the context of ALLAH as a God”. The jews and the christians worshipped the same GOD except that they raised the status of Jesus and Mary to GOD. There was no concept of Jesus or Mary in the days of Solomon and David and Moose. People used to worship one GOD .

    naturally, when omer wanted to create a proper mosque inside the boundary of a place labelled by Quran as AQSA, he also named it AQSA.

    Omer did not invade Jerusulem rather it was handed over to him by the JEWS. in order to exhibit the goodwill and the concept of ‘peaceful Coexistance’ he respected the rights of ownership of christians and jews and did not convert entire site to proper MOSQUE AL AQSA instead used a portion where he and KAAB (the ex-jew) were most sure of the establishing of prayer by all the prayers.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui if we are able to establish that there existed any primitive reasonable remains of ancient structure or some of the structure inside to be considered ‘bounded’ and to establish that any point in time during the history, the place was used to worship ONE GOD. then entire argument can be nullified and considered void that ‘THERE EXISTED NO MOSQUE IN THE PLACE AND MOHAMMED WAS LYING.”
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui the following statements verifies that the site was considered a place of worship for one GOD since the days of early judaisiam. 

    ” According to Jewish tradition and scripture (2 Chronicles 3:1-2), the first temple was built by Solomon the son of David in 957 BCE and destroyed by the Babylonians in 586 BCE. The second was constructed under the auspices of Zerubbabel in 516 BCE and destroyed by the Roman Empire in 70 CE. Jewish tradition maintains it is here the Third and final Temple will also be built. The location is the holiest site in Judaism and is the place Jews turn towards during prayer. Due to its extreme sanctity, many Jews will not walk on the Mount itself, to avoid unintentionally entering the area where the Holy of Holies stood, since according to Rabbinical law, some aspect of the Divine Presence is still present at the site.[2] It was from the Holy of Holies that the High Priest communicated directly with God.”

    Islam basic message is what clear to every one. All the 124,000 messengers and prophets came from the same source and preached the same message “GOD IS ONE”!

    the place bayt ul muqaddas (temple mount) was considered holy and masjid of GOD (Place of Worship).

    Quran mentioned the place by the words “the place of worship which is farthest from mecca”

    The dispute should be upon weather that place was farthest or not, and did there exist any other place considered in History as the WORSHIP place of ONE GOD and proved that it was the farthest from mecca and not bayt ul muqddas instead?

    Bayt ul muqaddas = arabic = the place of the holy !
    Mosque al aqsa = arabic = the place of worship that is farthest !

    Once the solomon or david made the temple, no matter how much devastation was caused by the romans or byzantanias and for what amounth of time the place was used for secular purposes instead, the place will remain attributed to its first owner “DAVID” !.. 

    People do not accept that palestine belong to muslims, because jews and christians hold the same rights. that is why omer was welcomed by the jews because they knew he will not order mass massacre or destro place but instead raise the slogan of peaceful coexistane and he did. this is why the remarkable people like omer and salauddin are still remembered with good names by their very enemies…

    BECAUSE OF THEIR CHARACTER !
  • Ghulam Rasool Here is a copy/paste from Wikipedia. One can find what could have been the truth ” Upon the capture of Jerusalem by the victorious Caliph Omar, Omar immediately headed to the Temple Mount with his advisor, Ka’ab al-Ahbar, a formerly Jewish rabbi who had converted to Islam, in order to find the holy site of the “Furthest Mosque” or Al Masjid al Aqsa which was mentioned in the Quran and specified in the Hadiths of being in Jerusalem.Ka’ab al-Ahbar suggested to Caliph Omar to build the Dome of the Rock monument on the site that Ka’ab believed to be the Biblical Holy of the Holies, arguing that this site is where Mohammad ascended to heaven during the Isra and Mi’raj miracle. The actual construction of the Muslim monuments at the southeast corner, facing Mecca, near which the al-Aqsa Mosque were built 78 years later. The original building is now known to have been wooden and to have been constructed on the site of a Byzantine public building with an elaborate mosaic floor. (The Persian conquest that immediately preceded the Arab conquest makes it uncertain who destroyed the building.)”
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui Now you will finally claim that what was the building entered by the Prophet, what was the building where buraq was tied up ! 

    —–

    This is the reported history of what was left right before the omer entrance.. surely there was some STRUCTURE INSIDE WHICH WAS BEING GUARDED BY THE JEWS..

    Sassanid vassal state period
    See Jewish revolt against Heraclius
    See also Byzantine-Sassanid War of 602-628
    In 610, the Sassanid Empire drove the Byzantine Empire out of the Middle East, giving the Jews control of Jerusalem for the first time in centuries. The Jews in Palestine were allowed to set up a vassal state under the Sassanid Empire called the Sassanid Jewish Commonewealth which lasted for five years. Jewish rabbis ordered the restart of animal sacrifice for the first time since the time of Second Temple and started to reconstruct the Jewish Temple. Shortly before the Byzantines took the area back five years later in 615, the Persians gave control to the Christian population, who tore down the partially built Jewish Temple edifice and turned it into a garbage dump,[20] which is what it was when the Caliph Omar took the city in the 630s.

    Consider the surrounding walls and gates as the doors through which mohammed entered and what he called “MOSQUE AQSA”

    CONCLUSION

    Naming Error!
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui Ghulam Rasool.. get some patience.. and read carefully !

    “Ka’ab believed to be the Biblical Holy of the Holie”

    MEANS KAAB WAS LOCATING THE PLACE OF DAVID WORSHIP !

    ” in order to find the holy site of the “Furthest Mosque” or Al Masjid al Aqsa which was mentioned in the Quran and specified in the Hadiths of being in Jerusalem.”

    This is wordings by Wikipedia. 

    BOTH OMER AND JEWS AGREED TO RUN THE AFFAIRS OF BAIT UL MUQQADAS TOGETHER. THIS WAS THE AGREEMENT BETWEEN THE BOTH SIDES AND THATS WHY JEWS AGREED TO HANDOVER ONLY TO OMER BECAUSE THEY KNEW OMER WOULD KEEP HIS PROMISE AND WILL NOURISH THE CULTURE OF ‘PEACEFUL EXISTANCE’

    This was a mutual agreement and a perfect solution for JEWS AND MUSLIMS to co exists.. 

    Both were inside the worship place of DAVID!

    and both allocated for themselves some place inside

    … i hope your problem is solved.
  • Ghulam Rasool This happens when one get blind and start copy/pasting as you are doing. This also shows how one can trust Wikipedia. Wikipedia is controlled by people like you, therefore there is something called WikiIslam which does not allow such false material to be added. You are so obcessed that you have to defend your faith no matter what. According to you copy/paste, Omar took control in 630 AD. While the prophet died on 8th June 632. Now you want me to believe Omar conquered Jerusalem two year before the death of prophet. Please, go take some rest.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui May be there is a error in the wikipedia… i accept.
    but wikipedia is not muslim’s monopoly.. atheists have the same right to go and modify it IF IT IS THAT EASY.. 
    You mean Wikipedia administraion is Pro-Muslims and Anti-Athesits? 
    lol…
    See More

    muslimwiki.com

    Native Americans and Islam There are numerous accounts of Muslims who were inter…See More
  • Ghulam Rasool Check here under the title “unhistorical propaganda”. You won’t find in any article of wikipedia which collide with the official claims of Muslims, always check on the backside of the article. Athiests or non muslims don’t “edit” wikipedia as is done by our brothers, they take it as a form of Jihad.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Al-Aqsa_Mosque

    en.wikipedia.org

    The article Al-Aqsa Mosque, along with other articles relating to the Arab–Israe…See More
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui The dates does’t matter. correct it yourself. The points i have raised are the core of the subject. 

    1. Mosque Al Aqsa – The farthest place of worship
    (Prove me wrong its not the correct translation)

    2. The noble site bait ul muqaddas (the holy place) is refered to jeruslem in general and to the site under study in particular

    3. the site was termed ‘noble’ because of the construction of the first place of worship of ONE GOD by david or solomon.

    4. the secular romans and other invadors destroyed most of it but no one can prove that they damaged it completely .. the remains were always there just like the ruins of moin judaro.. 

    5. the wall surrounding the place has doors and was considered as the boundary of the noble place. no one has claimed that prophet mohammed pbuh has particular mentioned some small mosque inside rather then the compound as a whole.

    6. in ISLAM mosques (places of worship) have special status, dirty things and animals are forbidden inside to keep it pure. the hadith that mentions that prophet left the buraq at the door or gate and tied it is the proof of what i said in the point 5

    7. Jews agreed to handover OMER peacefully. if Jews had to allow OMER to convert entire place into mosque, they would have rather fought for it. they knew they were asking for a PEACEFUL COEXISTANCE. thats why both parties agreed to rebuild some icon of their ancient rememberence. it is proven by the fact that OMER was accompained by an x-jew who had better knowledge

    8. If you are using hadith as a reference then you also make it a reference.

    The Messenger of Allah said: (On the night when I was taken on the Night Journey, I woke up in Makkah the next morning having anxiety that, I knew that the people would not believe me.) He kept away from people, feeling anxious and sad, then the enemy of Allah Abu Jahl passed by him and came to sit with him, saying mockingly, `Is there anything new’ The Messenger of Allah said, (Yes). He said, `What is it’ He said, (I was taken on a Journey last night.) He said, `Where to’ He said, (To Bayt Al-Maqdis.) He said, `Then this morning you were among us’ He said, (Yes). Abu Jahl did not want to say to his face that he was lying, lest he deny saying it when he called other people to hear him, so he said: `Do you think that if I call your people, you will tell them about what happened’ The Messenger of Allah said, (Yes.) Abu Jahl said, `O people of Bani Ka`b bin Lu’ay!’ People got up from where they were sitting and came to join them. Abu Jahl said, `Tell your people what you told me.’ The Messenger of Allah said: (I was taken on a Journey last night.) They said, `Where to’ He said, (To Bayt Al-Maqdis.) They said, `Then this morning you were among us’ He said, (Yes). They began to clap their hands together and put their hands on their heads in astonishment at this “lie” – as they claimed it to be. They said, `Can you describe the sanctuary to us’ Among them were some who had travelled to that land and seen the sanctuary, so the Messenger of Allah said, (I started to describe it, until I reached a point where I was not sure about some of the details, but then the sanctuary was brought close and placed near the house of `Uqayl – or `Iqal – so I could look at it and describe the details.) I could not remember those description. The people said, `As for the description, by Allah he has got it right. This was recorded Imam Ahmad by An-Nasa’i and Al-Bayhaqi

    the last words of this complete hadith WHICH YOU INTENTIONALLY HIDES

    “.. BY ALLAH HE HAS GOT IT RIGHT”

    if prophet was caught lying and he failed to describe the exact details then JEWS WOULD HAVE MADE EXCELLENT PROPAGANDA AGAINST HIM AND THEY WOULD HAVE MAIN IT THE PRIME ISSUE AGAINST MOHAMMED TO CREATE CHAOS AMOUNG HIS FOLLOWERS.

    BUT INSSTEAD we see no problem afterwards from his own followers regarding this. and that acceptance of mohammed rose to finally 100,000 die-hard followers..

    What made such followers still accept Mohammed after they witness jeruselem.. and instead of turning jews or atheists, they become more and more faithful??
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui ATHEISTS ARE EQUALLY RESPONSIBLE FOR THIS !!
    YOU ARE EQUALLY ARROGANT IN THE SUPPORT OF ATHEISM.

    so this is meaningless for any sensible person.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Al-Aqsa_Mosque

    en.wikipedia.org

    The article Al-Aqsa Mosque, along with other articles relating to the Arab–Israe…See More
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui This is the topic of great interest by palestinians, jews, christians, americans, isralities, muslims.. the page must receive heavy response from every community. so the result.. JUST LIKE PALESTINE IS HOT ISSUE SO SHOULD THIS. 

    Therefore your accusation is totally wrong, and every one should be equally responsible.

    close this chapter of wiki piki..

    TRY TO REFUTE USING LOGIC. IF YOU THINK SOME THING IS FABRICATION, THEN PRODUCE THE BETTER ONE WITH EXACT REFERENCE. THIS IS THE ETHICS OF SUCH A DISCUSSION. NO BLAMES AND NO ABUSES.

    Note: I appreciate your critical review of the wrong dates.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui Made this artifact to help understand what i have been saying since last 2 hours.

    http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=472418516137665&set=a.102254553154065.1175.100001085618610&type=1&theater

    Photo

    Upload for discussion on Mosque-Al-Aqsa. [Under Progress]

  • Ghulam Rasool You did not the link I gave you, you are asking me using logic while all you are trying to prove is not logical either. You know very well what is the function of feathers. When someone rise higher above, there is no use of those feathers left becausethere is no air to push down. But since knowledge of the prophet was limited just to the time he belonged, where everything which flies have to have feathers or wing. But this fantacy of a 7th century man does not make sense in these time. By the way, one thing to mention your use of the word ” bait ul muqaddas”, which is an arabised form of hebrew word “bait ha miqdas” which means ” gate of a holy temple”. Now please don’t start arguing that temple is the same as mosque.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui Check out into more details Your reference and got more points

    “The page only servces to boost my confidence in wikipedia. it seems its under heavy scrutny by the critics and is going through a well check and balance process – This is basically establ…See More

    en.wikipedia.org

    The article Al-Aqsa Mosque, along with other articles relating to the Arab–Israeli conflict, is currently subject to active arbitration remedies, as laid out during a 2008 Arbitration case, and supplemented by community consensus in November 2010. The current restrictions are:
  • Ghulam Rasool >>close this chapter of wiki piki..<<, I think it was you who wrote that few minutes back. you asked me to be logical. And suddenly you come with something which is written by some fellow muslim who share the same belief. I think it is too late, leave something for tomorrow too. it is almost morning here. As said earlier, there are many believers who are there to Islamize wikipedia.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui you are arguing over the super natural ! believe in such a creation comes from believe in a God that is capable of producing trillion galaxies , multi-verses and a billion big bangs !!.. so BURAQ is as easy as was the creation of entire universe.

    Your main point was that

    1. SUCH A SPEEDY TRAVEL NOT POSSIBLE. 

    If man made aircraft can, so God made Buraq can. 

    Infact still the God’s technology of animals is still better as they do not harm the environment (Global Warming / Pollution)

    2. IF MOHAMMED WAS TRUTHFUL, then explain where was the Mosque Al Aqsa

    Already proved that possible explanation from events that are poorly recorded in history is given and very logical to understand.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui 3. I have already made it clear that SUPERNATURAL has been proven by science.. so the lack of understanding of super natural by science is no evidence that super natural does not exist. You should agree to string theory writters as they are the pioneers of UNIFICATION OF NEWTONIAN AND QUANTAM LAWS in modern science and they are presenting the latest research to you.
  • Ghulam Rasool >>SUPERNATURAL has been proven by science<<, really!, then I must admit that I am an ignorant man.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui >>close this chapter of wiki piki..<<, I think it was you who wrote that few minutes back. you asked me to be logical. And suddenly you come with something which is written by some fellow muslim who share the same belief. 
    —-

    Closing wiki piki means stop arging over the wikipedia or wikiislam.. lets filter out the information that seems rational and logical and common in both !

    —–
    I think it is too late, leave something for tomorrow too. it is almost morning here. As said earlier, there are many believers who are there to Islamize wikipedia.

    -Ans:

    do not make such statements which can turn 180 degree back towards you… THERE ARE MANY ATHEISTS WHO ARE THERE TO ATHESIZED WIKIPEDIA
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui The String theory is all about SUPER NATURAL !

    a parallel universe that exists right around you.. creations form other dimensions living right in front of you, but since you are bounded in the 4 dimensional framework, you can not understand them through physically constrained brain of flesh.

    Refer to Applied string theory material on website. I will post for you
  • Ghulam Rasool If God made Burraq, then Hindu God rode Pushpak, how about checking Hindu mythology. How do you prove other religious claims to be false. Or you claims are valid because those are your claims.
  • Ghulam Rasool Please, don’t post link to sting theory or any other site, I won’t see that. And I really hate your copy/pasting too.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui Islam;s message is simple
    GOD IS ONE AND CHOSE HIS MESSENGERS AND PROPHETS IN EVERY TRIBE AND GROUPS. People altered his message for the greed lust desire and conveninece of thoughts ! and to create interemediate agents between God and mankind to be able to make God weaker and thus to find ways to deceive God.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui It is verified by the fact that Oneness of God is found in almost every ancient scripture
  • Ghulam Rasool Your link deleted, no more links and copy/pasting. Please. Throughout this debate you been pasting links etc. no more.
  • Ghulam Rasool >>GOD IS ONE AND CHOSE HIS MESSENGERS AND PROPHETS IN EVERY TRIBE AND GROUPS. People altered his message for the greed lust desire and conveninece of thoughts <<, please prove it with string theory that it is only Islam which is the true religion and all others are false. and no more copy pasting or links
  • Ghulam Rasool Link deleted again. >>It is verified by the fact that Oneness of God is found in almost every ancient scripture<<, what about Hindu mythology, Egyption or Greek Mythology. Even Christian has the concept of God, son and the holy spirit. I don’t know if I should consider those thre gods
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui ISLAM WILL BE IDENTIFIED THROUGH SIGNS AND NOT PROOFS!
    It will give ethical code and examples
    It will provide solutions of all mankind issues
    It will provide scientific evidences 
    It will provide unique miracles to the science to explore ! e.g. how come a muslims is able to remember by heart whole quran even children of age 7 .. but no man on earth can read by heart bible or old testament !
  • Ghulam Rasool You are just coming with claims and not evidence to prove your claims.
  • Ghulam Rasool Forcing young kid to memorize quran is a child abuse. They could have used those time in more productive way.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui lets meet again here. i have no magic to show here. we will have to engage discuss dialogue to be able to understand.

    i have already given two scientific evidence which mohammed could never have reached

    1. How he exactly described the state of a dying star “Red Eye Nebulae” while it is only observeable through electronics telescopes like HUBBLE

    2. How did mohamed actually described the 0.4 mm sized human embryo in the womb.

    3. The exact calculation of speed of light from QURAN

    4. the mathematics wonder in the quran through the power of 19
    how well balanced is the QURAN

    and so many

    we will contniue to discuss one by one.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui Ghulam Rasool … HOW WILL YOU RATE THE AMERICAN NATION IF EACH ONE OF THEM EXACTLY REMEMBERS WHAT IS THE WRITTEN IN THE EVERY CLAUSE OF THEIR CONSTITUTION?

    would they form a more better society or lesser?
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui Is this unification of thought or divisioning of thoughts that create problems in the society ?? IF THE 99.9% world agrees on POLIO ERADICATION brings betterment of society or the disagreement??
  • Ghulam Rasool How would you rate Pakistani or Saudi society?
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui if every man on earth exactly knows and remembers what each and every clause of Geneve Convetion holds and basic charter of humanity, would it create better society of lesser?
  • Ghulam Rasool How can you type so quicky?
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui Any perfect society is what that has achived excellence in the both domains
    1. Scientific Advancements 
    2. Ethical Code of Conduct

    Muslims are lagging 1 (lowest number of Ph.D produced in muslims)
    non muslims are lagging 2 (90,000 rapes in USA alone each year) 

    Perfection is yet to achive
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui I am a computer nerd since grade 7 : ).. i started programming on commodore 64 basica.. thats why today i m masters in computer engineerinng and processor architecture
  • Ghulam Rasool You typing speed is more of a magic than your arguments.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui Islam slows down the rate of scientific advancement thus (reduces rate of global warming, ozone destruction, sexually transmitted diseases and ensure every hungry man in africa gets food before we begin to explore mars by investing billion dollars) !!
    See More
  • Ghulam Rasool If you would have presented yor typing speed as a miracle to prove your case, this would have been much easier to convince me.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui : ) brother i m telling you.. i m an expert of C/C++ /ASP/JAVA/VISUAL C. Computer programming language and VHDL/VERILOG CHIP DESIGNING.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui haha : ) thansk for the compliments… out of other atheists i thought you would be the dumbest .. but amoung all them you have proved better.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui do not take Pakistan or saudia as examples of islamic society.. a islamic society is the one that produces great scientists like JABIR IBN HAYAN and Al-khatir ! and give the world the great models in mathematics (algebra) Biology (surgery) Chemisty (Molecular strucutre) etc…. 

    according to the hadith of prophet mohammed where he predicted future events, we are going through the worst part, . he said
    you will see

    1. Khilafat
    2. then Badshahat
    3. then Malookiat
    4. then great wars and internal conflicts
    5. alliance of foriegn coutnries will come to attack and loot you (NATO)
    6. the revolution begins and khilafh shall be restored

    its the U Curve of ISLAM.
  • Ghulam Rasool I am not an athiest, Alhumdo lillah I am a muslim  ,you know there are many category of muslims, fundamental muslims, moderate muslims, liberal muslims, secular muslims, cultural muslims. I am in the category of confused muslim, muslim who can’t handle the contradiction in the holy scirpture and practice of the holy prophet.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui At least you believe in God. that’s a great satisfaction for me that you have not broken the least required promise to be eligible for Paradise. .. yes one may go through many contradictions, but its only through the discussion and dialogue then we being to get answers.
  • Ghulam Rasool Please, don’t call Jabbar bin Hayyan or abu ali sina etc as muslims. Those converts were not called muslims but “mawali”. It is another matter if we take away the name of those Mawalis, the myth of the golden period of Islam expldes. I would have liked if you had mention Dr. Abdus Salam as a muslim scientist.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui Alright not arguing much.. for simplistic reply.. Those people were given state sponsorship .. the islamic soceity created an atomosphere where these people could nourish and to be considered the most emminent personalities of knowledge.. WHAT ELSE DO YOU WANT ??.. muslim scientists.. or a society where SCIENTIS GET BIRTH???
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui Dr. Abdul Salam is well respected in the field of science, but in the field of religion he is in error. There is no Prophet pbuh after Mohammed. This is the seal of prophets. 

    if dr. abdul salam has claimed of being a prophet, i could have thought ab…See More
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui Mr ghulam qadiyani spend his life serving for the british empires those who looted the wealth of this continent through systametic process begining with east india company. you musst have read the history of columbus, how he receied funding from the queen of england /france to finance his overseals slavery-hunt and christianity-converts campaign. east india company was an organized crime. how could a prophet wrote articles over articles in the support of such a government.
  • Ghulam Rasool I hope you know about one muslim scientist from Saudi Arabia, he died few year back. His name was Abdul Aziz bin Baz. He claims the earth is flat and sun revolve around earth. He challenged Dr: Abdus Salam for a debate, which Dr. Sahib did not reply. I…See More
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui and the same self-proclaimed prophet who on one hand attaches himself with the Quran that advocates self-reliance and Independece from Foriegn aggression (Surah Anfal, Taubah, ….) but isolates himself from the muslims struggling for liberation?
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui Just like there exists 10 million atheists who think out of 1000000000000000000000000000000000 possibilities 1 chance of the creation of life on planet earth was a normal phenomenon ! there can also exists such 0.2% examples of dumbs in muslim society.. the more the quantity the more is the percentage of retards !!

    Secondly, its a natural fact that all great scientists have born among JEWS .. evey nation or tribe has been given a special ability !.. some are might and tall.. some are blakc and dark.. bengolis are famous for their skills in mathematics… paksitanis are preferred in their american engilsh accent over indians … americans are famous for taking risks and being insane.. !!
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui By the way the SILICON VALLEY, USA is full of engineers from Pakistan specially NED university. Silicon Valley is world wide famous for chip fabrication processes and digital IP Designs.
  • Ghulam Rasool IF I buy your argument about being given special abilities, then what ability has been given to Muslims other than defending their faith at any cost. Almost all scientist are athiest, science ask for questions, religion ask for submission. this is the basic difference which could be the reason which is stopping them not their genetic make up.
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui In one of my previous discussion with zulfiqar, i presented some facts about why muslim regions are the most destabilized regions because of the interests of western powers. 

    a simple example…

    compare the condition of pakistan before the SOVIAT Aggression in afghanistan to now.. were we not better ?? were we not going to become asian tiger??

    We are always the victim of foriegn aggresion and thus effects stablity of our system.

    how many universities of internal ranking, AMERICA Build in pakistan during 10 years of aggression and forced assistance with NATO??
  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui List of Muslim Inventions when we had central khilafat

    prophet mohammed already told us that the kind of countries you live in you will get the treasure (of OIL) very soon.. so stay united. if you divide you may fall.. 

    what we were before fall of ottomon caliphate

    http://metaexistence.org/inventions.htm

  • Ammar Ahmed Siddiqui sorry took time for finding that content – internet slow
    Check this out
    You will know why post 18th century we have been selectively decentrazlied divided disintegrated and destablized

    http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=472441006135416&set=a.102254553154065.1175.100001085618610&type=1&theater

References:
1. Wikipedia Problem
2. Embryo shape from Quran
3.  Quantam wormholes could carry people
4. Islamic Content on the Subject
5. Wikipedia
6. Photo